I cleaned a nursing home w/spin vac and rotary and they are complaining about streaks on the carpet. I went over next day following cleaning and told them it was just probably pile reversal from the cleaning and it should go away in a couple of days. They called back and went over again 8 days later and it still has the marks but not as quite severe. I was using a drive block from jon don that has tiny shower feed holes in block and used a hogs hair pad. I did notice as I was cleaning a lot of the solution was being spun out in front of the rotary. I would make a wet pass right to left and a dry pass then left to right and another right to left, and then move foreward and start my next wet pass while overlapping. If anyone is doing encap. with rotary with success how are you doing it and with what type of driver or do you use a shampoo brush or some type of pad with a driver.
p.s. when i tested this carpet i didn't worry about som much going from right to left straight with the dry passes , I would just clean like a 15-20sq.ft. area and go back with dry passes. When i did it this way i didn't notice any steaks.
Thanks for any info

If you are getting solution thrown off your drive plate it sounds like you are using too much solution. One gallon diluted should cover 350-500 sq ft. You want just a touch of foam to develop- it should disappear after 1-2 seconds. Too much solution could be a problem. Also a rotary might leave streak marks depending on the type of carpet it is. Sometimes it can be near permanent so you will want to be very careful and may require hot, hot water and some light agitation to get it to come out okay. Too aggressive a brush can do damage as with any rotary product.

HTH

Tony

Ditto what Tom said.

You told me that it was a loop carpet. Loop carpets do not generally have too much problem with pile distortion. A few days of foot traffic and vacuuming would have corrected that. So we can pretty safely rule out pile distortion/reversal. I have cleaned literally MILLIONS of sq ft of commercial carpet with a Chemstractor using pads. This is basically the same scrubbing method you used. And I've never had any problem with marking. Occasionally we can get some pile distortion but it walks off in a couple of days of foot traffic and vacuuming, especially on a loop carpet.

The next possibility would be uneven cleaning. This is more than likely the case. Uneven cleaning could have been caused by a number of possibilities... Uneven dispersing of the solution causing wet patches and dry patches will leave a splotchy appearance. Using too much solution will be a problem. Using not enough solution to wet the fiber is also a problem. Not overlapping the cleaning passes can leave lines. Excessive soiling in the carpet may also require additional passes to get it clean. Inadequate pre-vacuuming can make mud, which will leave a poor appearance. There are many possibilities.

My suggestion at this point would be to reclean the carpet for free. I know that's not what you want to do, but it will win a favorable response with the customer. Tell them that you always strive to provide perfect service, and when it's not perfect you want to make it right for them. Tell them how very happy you are that they let you know there was a problem. And make them see your enthusiasm for making their problem go away. They will most likely be impressed with your honest and ethical approach and this should turn them into a cheerleader customer. So in the long run it's worth it. When you reclean - scrub the carpet in the opposite direction. If you went north/south last time - go east/west this time.

Hope this helps.

Rick Gelinas

So I am Tom now HUH?????


LOL

TONY

Yeah Whaasssupp Wit Dat!

Don't insult the big guy like that

You might want to try spraying the carpet again with your ecapsulater and grooming with a good stiff carpet brush.

I have this problem with an account I clean, if I let the carpet get to dry before I groom the swirl marks are very hard to vac out.

Two things to do to avoid this problem;

1. Apply 3 or 4 rows of solution and then with the solution of make small circles and big circles over that area, scrubbing each square foot equally. This avoids the "hills and valleys" that can occure even on tight commercial pile.

2. Always groom afterwards while the carpet is still damp.

Ed

brainfart.

Hey they both start with  T o ...
after the first two letters it all looks the same.

Riley

The funny thing was when I was cleaning I used about 6 gallons cleaning 2000 sq.ft. which I know is a little on the high side but the carpet never did really ever foam except for when I went over the entrance mats so it was really hard to tell if I was putting enough solution down. Do you ever clean some carpets where the spin vac doesn't seem to be foaming? When you used a driver with you chemstactor Rick, was it a type with little holes throughout it?

Brian,

We're not looking for much foam - just slight whitening on the surface like Tom or Tony or Tory or Tonto described above. Some carpets don't foam as well as others. I don't know the science behind why it does this. Heated detergent does foam a little better than cold.

And yes my pad driver on the Chemstractors do have holes in them. Some solution slings off these drivers - but the majority works its way through the driver.

Jeff,

Is that on a loop carpet or a cut pile?

 

Rick- I mean there was no whitening unless I got stuck in a corner with some solution on.

The anonymous was me Rick,--I also used bucket heaters to boost the heat of solution. Couldn't leave your hand in it for more than 1/2 second.

Brian,

I've seen carpets that won't foam even with heated detergent. Other carpets foam quite well with all other factors being equal. So it leads me to believe there are characteristics in these low foaming carpets that are killing the foam, i.e. soil conditions, fiber, loom oil, chemical residue, hard water, etc. It's hard to pin it down exactly, but I have definitely seen variations in foaming on different carpets.

I'm not sure what's causing your problem. I wish I could SEE it. It could be pile distortion. Is that what it looks like to you? Or does it look like shading possibly from uneven cleaning?

I think the simplest remedy would be to run over the carpet quickly in the alternate direction. A quick reclean like that should alleviate the problem. If it is in fact pile reversal, you could try spraying the carpet lightly with hot water to moisten it and then rake the carpet.

Brian,

I just thought of one more possible culprit - and I hope it's not this one... You said that

"used bucket heaters to boost the heat of solution. Couldn't leave your hand in it for more than 1/2 second."

If it's an Olefin carpet you could have damaged the fiber with very high heat. Olefin has a very low heat set. If the water was scalding hot and you added rotary friction to this equation it would be possible that you could have reshaped the fiber. This is a long shot. But it is a possibility. I doubt that you did this because I never did it and I've cleaned a lot of Olefin with a rotary. But that doesn't mean that it isn't in the realm of possibility.  Like I said, I wish I could SEE it.

Rick Gelinas

Rick,

Have you ever caused a problem on olifin with too hot water?

Ed

No I haven't, but I know someone that did - (Bob Wittkamp). :O)

Bob told us in an IICRC class that he permanently damaged a Mailbox Etc. store's Olefin carpet with his truckmount and his RX-20. He said the worst part is that it's where his PO Box is, so he has to look at it all the time.

Rick Gelinas

When using a rotary machine try to avoid swinging it from side to side and move it more in a straight line going forward than backward, it is the rapid swinging action that tends to leave swirl marks in the carpet. The only way to correct is to re-clean and set the pile after cleaning. Also Rick mentioned about the heat and that could be a problem on polypropylene, but I doubt if you could actually deliver water that hot unless you had the heater right in your solution tank.

I can't imagine hot water damage from the Cimex, as many TM's exceed this heat and you rarely hear of them damaging carpets. I haven't and I used a firebreathing PC for 10 years.

Steve Lawrence

Like I said... "This is a long shot... I doubt that you did this because I never did it and I've cleaned a lot of Olefin with a rotary. But that doesn't mean that it isn't in the realm of possibility."


Rick Gelinas

I'm not real sure Rick if it is or isn't pile reversal. The carpet is such a low low loop pile carpet. It does seem to stand out more where there is fluroresant light right above the carpet. I'll try to clean the opposite direction and see what happens. One thing I didn't mention was after I had gotten done cleaning a area we sat out air movers. After about 20 minutes of them blowing you could really see the darker area rows next to the lighter area rows spaced out real evenly. Of course when I went back it wasn't as noticeable as then. I kinda remember feeling the darker areas and comparing them to the lighter areas and the darker areas did seem more wet. Thanks for all you help Rick. Appreciate it much.

Maybe you could try a pile lifter over an area and see what that does. Maybe the aggressiveness of a pile lifter would stand those fibers up straight again.
Just a thought, it sounds easier than re-cleaning

That would certainly be an easier option to try if I had one. Thanks, Brian

I went back last night to reclean half of the nursing home. This time I tried Ed Diamonds advice and went left to right and right to left about 4 rows wet and kinda went up and down with rotary on the dry passes. Went back there this morning and it looks much better, still a little noticeable from the wet passes but not bad. Housekeeping sup. happy.