Rick, I have a unique situation in this department.

I have a customer that has 4"x6" ceramic tile throughout a large part of her house. She and the previous owner have used wax on this for years and years (Mop 'n Glo, I believe). Now she wants the wax stripped and the tile left in its natural state (the grout is in pretty rough condition, even missing in a number of places). I tried a variety of strippers and the only one that I've got to work with any success is Cobb's Dynachem non-ammoniated floor stripper. Have you tried your product on floors like this? Has anyone? Just curious. I know that it's not a stripper but at times some products have some pretty nice side benefits.

Years of using any sealer can result in layers upon layers of buildup. This will be difficult to remove with any product. I found it calls for a lot of hand scrubbing near the edges where the build-up was thicker. Rotary with a stripping brush usually worked better than a pad because the brush bristles would get down into the depressions and the grout lines.

A high alkaline stripper worked best for me. If Cobb's product works best for you, I would stay with it but expect a lot of work.

Scott Warrington

Scott Warrington
Tech support Bridgepoint & Interlink Supply

mix the stripper as strong as the directions say you can.
I use Spartans Emuslifier Plus.

Let it sits for about 5 minutes. aggitate the stripper, then apply more stripper let it sit for about 20 minutes then start scrubbing. I use a high pro black pad some are green or purple. I also use a hard surface want with about 900 psi to rinse with.

Grout line will most likely need a grout brush to get into the lines with any results.

Charge a bundle as this work is a pain in the back end

Mop-N-Glow? There's you're problem... The stuff will not strip well regardless of what you use.

Mop & Glow is a bear to remove. It doesn't respond to commercial strippers. Floor Strippers attack the metal cross-link (typically zinc) in the floor finish. Mop-N-Glow is a household product and therefore doesn't have typical commercial finish properties. It is garbage and will destroy a floor.

I have experienced Mop-N-Glow MANY times on VCT floors. It can be next to impossible to get it off the floor if there's any kind of build-up. On a textured floor it will be even worse! I would probably pass on this one. And if you choose to pursue this job, it would be wise promise the customer nothing, charge plenty, have them sign a release showing that they acknowledge that they wrecked the floor, and then hope for the best. Replacing the floor might be worth considering.




Rick Gelinas
encapman

She's a good customer of mine. I already stripped an area for her. I was successful, but it was a LOT of work. Especially the areas that had to be done by hand near the walls, cupboards and toilet. The only reason I stopped is that I ran out of stripper (and I have to admit I was a little frustrated). She has a small kitchen, dining room, hall and bathroom that needs doing. She also tried it herself and appreciates the work that must go into it. I quoted her my "good customer rate" of $900.00. Otherwise I think I would have quoted 1200.00 or 1300.00. It truly is a bear to do. She didn't hesitate on the $900.00 quote. She just wants it done. I've had other mop 'n glo nightmares and often wondered why it was so difficult to remove.

I got interested in this thread about Mop N Glo and dug up an MSDS to see what the big deal was all about. Here's what it said:

Ingredients:
Tributoxyethyl phosphate 1-2%
Dipropylene glycol methyl ether 5-7%
Acrylic resin(s) (unspecified) 2-4%
Acrylic acid polymer/copolymer 25-30%
Nonylphenoxy poly(ethyleneoxy) ethanol 1-2%

OK so it's a high solids acrylic resin...everything else they care to report are adjuncts to help the acrylics stay in suspension. My thinking is that why wouldn't straight ammonia break it down, with good dwell time?

I know it's not a pleasant task working with ammonia but I just can't see what magic ingredient (especially if it's not a zinc crosslinked resin) would make it that tough to remove. Remember that most strippers are based on safer monoethanolamine, or triethanolamine - not ammonia, and that just maybe the extra punch of aqueous NH3 would do the trick.

Have you tried ammonia? Let us know.

Never thought of that at all. Maybe I'll go get a gallon and try it. Only thing I'll need is a good mask.

I'm glad there are chemists (or almost chemists)on this board. That's one subject I never cared to take in school and don't know the first thing about it.

Thanks

Have not to my knowledge dealt with Mop n Glo, but everyone who I know that has dealt with it says bad words that I just know their Mommies never taught them...

I'd have some concerns about using one area as a sample - if the other areas don't look as good, she may believe you have done something different, even if you worked just as hard on them.

I agree with Rick - put it in contrast to floor replacement - it is not normal maintenance.

Well, I don't know that floor replacement is that much of an option, certainly one that is possible but probably not practical. Usually one of last resort...

So, do we jump to the last resort in despair? I think he should try two options here, one being the use of ammonia and then if this doesn't work, then the use of a butyl-based stripper. Like dissolves like etc. That'll do it for sure but butyl-based products are worse for health than ammonia...

The reasoning is that several finishes use an amine to keep the resin in suspension and when that flashes off, the resin coalesces adn leaves the film. So how do you destroy the film? Use an amine stripper...

Recreate the scene of the crime. Ditto for the glycol ether in Mop N Glo.

Seems a bit more "pondered" than replacing those ceramic tiles in a "large part of the house" at what, $4 per square foot?

I've had relatively decent success with Johnson's Freedom Stripper on Mop-N-Glow. It's worked better than other products I've tried. It might be worth trying.




Rick Gelinas
encapman

Charles - I couldn't agree more with you.

Replacement IS very expensive, not to mention you gotta move furniture and it's disruptive and dusty and leaves the place a mess for days and you hafta have construction workers in your home who aren't always known for their social graces and lets' see..you gotta wait for months sometimes cuz the company is booked and such. Plus when foks are ripping your home up, you can get the disorganized feeling you can't find anything ever again. Leads to marital arguments, heavy drinking and eating high cholesterol fried fatty foods, among other problems.

All of which should help the client ponder the cost...most maintenance issues have an 'unspoken budget' in the mind of the householder. She calls us and is thinking: "I don't know what it will cost, but it may be about $300-$500. Oh well, that's life".

But if we see that it really should be more like $900-$1400, and we don't explain the alternative of replacement first, she is likely to run us out of the house and call someone else. If she ponders replacement for a few minutes, she may realize it's much easier to just bump her mental budget up a speck than to deal with replacement.

When people complain about the cost of my maintenance fees, I use the illustration of changing oil on a car. It does cost money to change the oil. If you feel the $20 is too much money, don't do it. Just wait til the car grinds to a halt and buy a new car.

It's for putting it in perspective, that's all.