Did (tried to do) the offices attached to a helicopter hanger today with Cimex and Releasit.

The carpet is 8 months old cream coloured 100% wool sisal. It has a light grey haze over the whole carpet except where mats and cupboards had been. These areas are beautiful pristine cream and contrast greataly with the grey.

Releasit wouldn't touch it, neither would 3:1 Releasit. Neither would Vol. Dry Solent, non volatile dry solvent, acid spotter or alkaline spotter.

Any suggestions.

It seems it is what the helicopter tech called EFlux - the by-product of exhaust gas, basically the exhaust from burnt kero. It forms a black soot on their chopper which they use Bytral Nitrate to remove it.

The old adage "know when to hold 'em. Know when to fold 'em" applies here. Sisal is a grass. It is very absorbant and is very sensitive to any increase in humidity. The only cleaning method I have heard specifically mentioned is Host. Based on other characteristics of the fiber, I think the Host product would be very difficult to completely remove. Nor would it be effective in removing the exhaust "haze". I'd walk (but that's just me)!good luck.

Sounds like a place for a tile.. maybe VCT or something..



Steve Dobson
ProFloor
Custom Cleaning Services

Neil said its a WOOL sisal.

Lots and lots of that stuff over here in New Zealand. Its all called sisal by everyone from sales down. They really mean sisal lookalike. Totally different animal from true sisal. On a side note, while I've never used host or dry powder compounds, I've used Releasit once with an 'ok' result on true sisal.

Neil,

In my use of Releasit, I've found that it doesn't work very well in HIGH QUALITY wool carpet. Either comm or resi.

If you've got a exhaust residue problem, try a product that is made for either soot or charged particles.

Yeah, you're going to say you can't get one that is recognised as being suitable for wool below 8.5 here in NZ but I think you guys might say below 9.5?????

If you have access to the property, ask if you can go back and conduct some tests to see which product will sort there problem for them. (notice the use of THIER problem FOR THEM) I use a lot of Prochem stuff because we have very limited ranges over here compared with you guys and also I have a Prochem agent right here.

I would try a small test with three different products that I would consider in the running to correct this problem........ these are all going to be HWE options so I hope I don't get in trouble

Do three small 1' square test spots with these...

Power Burst.

Ultrapac Renovate..... this is a fire damage cleaner.

Filter out. or equivalent filtration soil cleaner.

Heat the solutions, apply, scrub with a small horse hair brush, dwell and FLUSH FLUSH FLUSH with and acid rinse. Possibly post pad if you're concerned about over wetting. Speed dry with air movers and even dehumidifiers if necessary.

You wouldn't really consider going a reasonable sized area with Filter Out, but its purpose is to see a good comparison for the other two to really see if they are working. It'll also let you know if its a true charged soil residue as well.

Perhaps someone else may have other suggestions as to product available to you that I'm not aware of that may also work.

Do test till you find the one that does it right before you waste more of your time.

Hope this helps.

John

John Middleton
Carpet Pro Ltd
Palmerston North
New Zealand

I'm sorry I don't know if you know much about wool, but heres a couple of other pointer when dealing with wool carpet.

Wool can absorb up to something like 30% its own weight.

That equates to having to put down around twice as much solution as you would for a nylon and possibly as much as three times the solution for poly.

Vac vac and more vac. Wool can hold an awesome amount of dry soil before it 'looks' dirty.

Spray your detergent down as hot as you can.

Gentle massaging with a soft carpet brush.

Flush with more water than you'd use on synthetics.

Especially with the use of higher pH detergents, use a good acid rinse.

If its heavily soiled, don't be afraid of high heat. I have a Genesis and often use 240-270 ATM on wool.

Post pad or speed dry if theres a concern.

Check integrity of seams before cleaning.

Hope this helps.

Cheers, John

John Middleton
Carpet Pro Ltd
Palmerston North
New Zealand

John,
I am from Newcastle New South Wales Australia.

It is a RESIDENTIAL 100% wool carpet. I know because it is exactly the same carpet I have at home. The trainee at the hanger said he tried to get the boss to choose a different colour and different type of carpet, but to no avail. They previously had a grey commercial carpet which though caked with exhaust did not look as if it was. The boss has been making the young guy vacuum nearly every day but to no avail in regard to the exhaust build-up.

Your answers were what I was expecting. The Australian manufacturer of Prochem products is here in Newcastle, so I will give their chemist a phone call and discuss it further with him. Hopefully get a few samples of those products.

Also, there is a guy here in Newcastle who does a lot of smoke restoration work, I will contact him as well.

Thankyou.

Hi Neil,

your very welcome!!!!

Just accross the ditch aye!!!

Are you the guy with the challenger Op's on the Aussie board?

Cheers, John

John Middleton
Carpet Pro Ltd
Palmerston North
New Zealand

John,
yes, that is me.

In the immortal words from Paul Newman in Cool Hand Luke, "What we have here is a failure to communicate". The original post refered to a 100% wool Sisal. I think there is a nomenclature issue here, rather than a "knowledge of wool" issue. Wool is wool, but Sisal IS a grass. Look it up.

Hey, I've heard that there may be more sheep than people in New Zealand! But no one has been able to verify because whenever someone tries to count them they fall asleep. Ha Ha Ha . I'm sorry guys Heh Heh, I'm Baah Baah Baad. I couldn't resist. Take care. All in good fun.

Stan

Neil, I done a Helicopter Base that was home for 21 Blackhawk’s up in Townsville. The hanger it self was hard surface and shined like a mirror. It also had polished studded rubber areas in the hanger. The associated offices were all light blue/grey looped 100% wool. This place had no money spared on it; the government went all the way. The use of wool was for the lower fire risk factor.

I did not have Releasit at the time. What I did find worked very effectively was Sensation. Now I know it has a high ph, but it was the only thing that would get it clean. So if after trying all the suggestions on this board and you still can not get it to work for you and nothing else will, in other words it is a do or die situation, maybe you will have to resort to using Sensation. Over the years I have had to resort to using this from time to time to achieve the results I wanted. If you do use it just make sure that you really neutralize. Neil this product is made only 1 1/2 hours from where you live. I use to clean all the carpets every month in 9 of Mike Ball Dive Sports boats which are popular with people diving on the Great Barrier Reef. These would suck in diesel fumes from those twin V16 GM motors through the air conditioning and end up as terrible soot scum film over the carpets and upholstery, hence the need to clean so regularly. It was the only product that would remove this film of the dive boats carpets and upholstery.

If I was to do this hanger now I would have tried the Releasit with the grey Fiber Plus Max pads. They are more gentle on the wool loops than a brush, but more aggressive than the Fibre Plus. I use these on the the Birch Carrol cinemas that you are familiar with. They only clean their wool carpets once every year in the foyers. It usually takes about 9 hours just to remove the gum in the foyers alone. They only use carpet sweepers, not vacuum cleaners. You get the picture that they do not get all that well maintained. The normal beige Fiber Plus doesn’t even make a dent in them. The Fiber Plus Max do a great job. Have you tried the Fiber Plus Max on this job?

I know that Releasit does more than a fair job on cutting through all sorts of oil and grease. Earlier this year I done a carpet in a mechanics work shop that had carpet loose laid in the work area. They put the challenge to me that I would not be able to get the carpet clean. One stain about three feet across was where the oil out of a gear box had drained on to the carpet. Well that carpet come up just great. Even surprised me. I checked it out when I was by there two weeks later, and it still looked good and they were still raving about it. So I know it really has grease cutting ability, but in this situation I made sure that the Releasit solution in the Cimex tank was real hot.

Rick might be able to add to this, but can a water based citrus solvent be added to the Releasit to boost its grease cutting ability just for this job of Neil’s in the helicopter base. That is what made the Sensation work so well, it would cut through this film. If not, can you pre spray with a citrus base pre spray, massage this into the carpet with your Cimex to break off this film of soot, then once this has been achieved do the normal Releasit cleaning.
Gary.

Thanks Gary.