Where do i begin???

I am somewhat new to the VLM industry.
I am looking to start a low cost VLM company in Ohio.
I have the opportunity for commercial and residential work.
In the beginning i will be working this part-time (evenings & weekends).
I have to keep the bills and insurance supplied some how (one child with some health issues).

I am trying to break away from a sales postion job in corporate america and start up a biz on my own that i can operate at my own pace for the time being and gro as i am able. I really like what vlm has to offer and i do believe i can do it and be succesful at it. I know we will take some crap from the HWE rug-suckers seeing how the bigger dogs rule the roost in this area.

I am trying to figure between one of the following for a start-up and build from there but figured i would ask you pro's your opinion, what machine do i start with and how much product do i need to get started? I am considering one of the following items and in this order so far:

Challenger system
CSS system (www.ccsop.com)
Vento
Cimex - if i can srape together that kind of dough...

I am looking for a VLM system where i am able to add earth friendly / biodegradable / eco-green products since being eco friendly and green-clean is the selling point of our biz. We have a few possible accounts with some day cares / medical offices and dental offices and besides carpet and floor care they have asked us about tile & grout and for a wipe down service. This will give you some sort of idea what we are looking to do to start with.

To start out it is just me and a very close relative so we can only afford one machine to start with and will also need some supplies.

please be nice to a newbie...

just what your looking for

http://pub9.bravenet.com/forum/760471488/show/561216

add the chemicals and a stair tool and you are rolling along nicely... if i had the cash i'd prob buy it myself but i just bought a HOS (same as vento).

Twelve or thirteen years ago I was where you are. I was able to purchase a used Cimex and a porty. I had been playing with the business for 12 years prior to that and owned a couple of swing machines & a Von Schrader. However, I look at that purchase as the turning point in my business. I paid $700.00 for the porty and $1400. for the Cimex and was able to pay for them in the first two jobs. That Cimex is still working. With that one machine you can do everything that comes your way i.e. carpets, VCT, ceramic tile, big or little jobs, use brushes or pads. If you can only afford one machine I would get the Cimex IMHO.

With a log in/email addy; starting with

G F U

I am not sure if I wish to answer this.

Wish you all the best in your new venture.

Cheers,

Shorty.

I've seen the light, and changed my ways.

Any of the machines you are asking about would work well.

The Challenger or a Vento are good for residential and smaller commercial. The Cimex is perfect for commercial. So it depends on which market you want to go for. For me personally, I LOVE commercial, so the Cimex is what I'd suggest there. As Mark mentioned above, the Cimex propelled him from a start up to a successful business in a few short years - not too shabby! If I can help in any way give me a shout rick@excellent-supply.com









Rick Gelinas
encapman

If you decide to buy an OP machine, you'll need to be very careful on cut pile carpet. Some OP machines are so aggressive they will rattle pictures off a wall or mantle. An OP machine makes many small orbits so there are many centers of orbit that can untwist the tuft. A rotary only has only 1 center of orbit and is much more gentle. They have been used safely for years.

I have a 19" Cimex, a 500 psi Ninja, 2 2-speed rotaries, and a battery powered sprayer I can sell. That combination will set you up for commercial and residential. If you're for real, contact me.

David VB

Cimex, Challenger or Vento. I would buy new and let Rick put together a Lease Pkg. One job a month would pay the lease payment.

TK I was where you are EXACTLY (sales Exec 12 billion $ corp) 1 1/2 years ago and only started this full time in July. One of the problems you face is where the biz is going to lead you.
I started out thinking I'm going residential so I bought HWE then I got a couple of commercial accts that were custom made for the Cimex so I bought it.
Well I like to stay in touch with my customers so i go to my bigger commercial accts and inspect monthly so to clean up little areas i got the challenger (great machine btw). Now it's taking me the Tile and Grout clean/color seal route so i needed more pressure so i bought a bigger tm. Anyway the biggest money maker and "WOW" factor for commercial accts is hands down the Cimex GREAT MACHINE and Rick can give you every tip and trick to make it talk.
Good luck if you's like to discuss anything give me a call 678-350-3402
I don't have anything for sale.

I would like to hear Rick comment on using an OP machine on cut pile. Rick, do you still have the same view you shared with me a few months ago?

As to buying new or used, I've bought new for years. This fall I bought a used Genesis 56 with 100 hours on it for 1/2 price. The best buy I've made in years. I've also sold a Tsunami that was like new that Tom Cullen loves and I sold a 20" GLS that was like new. Both sold for just over half price. I also sold a 20" Brute that only had a few hours on it. Buying used can be a great deal if you find the right equipment.

I've lost some selling this equipment, but I've learned a lot by testing these machines and systems myself. It's been worth it to me to not have to take someone else's word for what works. This is especially true when those opinions come from salesmen or people on these boards who have a year or two in the business and are so eager to share their wealth of knowledge.

If you're just starting out, I guess a decision would need to be made on buying a machine brand new or buying 2 or 3 machines used that would allow you to do commercial, residential VLM and have an extractor for urine etc.

If it were me, I'd be looking for a good used Truckmount (they are easy to find) and a Cimex. I've tried VLM for residential. I started with Host in the early 80's, Ultra Dry off and on since and recently CCS OP and a GLS followed by a rotary with pads. As much as I wanted to not have to deal with a truckmount, I just can't do VLM in homes.

Commercial is a whole different story.

I started out with a TM. Did residential and commercial with it.

Since then I have sold my TM, and never have looked back. Now do VLM. I use a cimex for commercial and a op machine for residential.

My suggestion, start with an op machine, this way you could do residential and commercial. Yes, it will take you longer to do commercial with an op machine verses cimex, but when you have a few more pennies saved you can buy that yellow beast!!!

Oh yeah, don't forget to get a good vac. Just purchased a Lindhaus from Rick, wow what a great machine.

Good luck.

Jay

Hey Dave,
Just curious, but why did you sell your Brute? The folks at CCS assure me that the Brute would serve me much better than my Cimex. I have'nt had any experience with the Brute, but I know I love my Mex and can't imagine parting with it.

9 years ago i started out with focus on resi CC'ing and a HWE portable. didn't work out for me physically and the results were often poor: mostly my noob fault as it's operator error to blame most times.

3 years ago i bought a Cimex with a new focus on commercial. worked great! 18 months ago i bought a Challenger with a new focus on resi. as with any OP / rotary, you do have to be careful of tip bloom as David mentioned, but you have to be more careful with an OP because they are so aggressive (which is why they work faster & better in most ppl's opinions, but this is argued).

like Rick L., around June-July of '06 we went full-time on carpet cleaning, losing 70% of our income (2 nightly janitorial accounts; 1 went under, the other went cheaper).

since then, we have re-focused on comm and are loving it. resi is nice to have for my very small business because i look at resi accounts as "filler" for when i don't have enough comm jobs lined up...it all seems to work out. BTW (By The Way), i don't mean "filler" in a negative way...i treat all my acounts with the same respect and attention to detail. but that is exactly why i prefer comm over resi: resi takes me a good bit of time with my OP. it does a fantastic job, but since it takes so long i am now making less $ per hour. Cimex does phenomenal on comm and makes me more $ per hour. i'm not materialistic and i don't work for the pure fun of it, i work to pay the bills and provide for the fam, so the Cimex is my answer.

if i were in your shoes and were only buying 1 tool as you stated, knowing what i know now, i'd pick up a Cimex. i can't imagine doing any comm job over 2000 sq.ft with my Challenger. and the majority of ppl on the forums that own both a Cimex and any OP for commercial, prefer the Cimex.

don't forget: you can remove soil with your Cimex same as an OP (contrary to popular, inexperienced belief) by simply using bonnets.

instead of leasing, i recommend doing what i did and take out one of the many credit cards that offer 12 months with zero interest. JUST MAKE SURE YOU PAY IT OFF IN 12 MONTHS OF COURSE!

hope this helps. great thread with several different ideas for you. you are in a nice position with many choices. do lots of research, email ppl and better yet, call ppl, especially end-users, and speak with them directly. email me your phone number if you'd like and i'll answer any questions on my time & dime.

take care --- Derek.

I would second what Derek said- maybe you can find a used Cimex; sometimes Rick has a contact for someone getting out of the business. The Cimex, IMO, would be the first purchase, especially if you are hoping to get a few larger accounts. THEN a Vento/etc.

But I know it's tough on the wallet at first; do what's good for you, not just what WE say.

Kevin Kluth
Pinnacle Cleaning
www.dryinonehour.com
www.fullerdirect.com/0704120

David you are correct. An OP machine can be aggressive on a cut pile carpet. Make sure the pads are wet and keep the machine moving. Caution is a necessity. You mention that you had a Brute, you also mentioned rattling stuff off the shelves. The Vento and the Challenger are smoother than what you have described. Not all OP machines run like a jackhammer.





Rick Gelinas
encapman

Good description Rick, though the Brute is smoother than the smaller machines.

I'm told the jackhammer OP machines clean faster, but I suppose a grinder would remove soil pretty quickly also.

I have seen damage to a few cut piles with an OP and the OP cleaners that I've communicated with privately say you have to be very careful. My question is if you can see damage from time to itme with the naked eye, what level of damage may be occuring that can't be seen when standing.

I have several machines, best money maker by far for me is the Cimex. I have done miles of commercial carpet, polished some marble and polished , prepped lots of concrete with this machine. Rick can hook you up with all the goodies for your versatile Cimex.
Craig

When I bought that first Cimex 12 years ago, it was after having used one when I worked for a carpet cleaner prior to that. Most of the usage was on residential carpet, using the brushes. I didn't even know you could use pads until a couple of years after I bought the machine. That means for ten years I was using a Cimex on resi carpet without a problem.

I became a Cimex Distributor in 1994 but was not happy with the results on commercial carpet. We were using L.S.T. (low surface tension) from Ed York to clean with. I lost interest in the line as there was no good cleaning chemicals to run under the Cimex at that time. And then came Rick Gelinas and the rest was history.

I became a Cimex Distributor in 1994 but was not happy with the results on commercial carpet. We were using L.S.T. (low surface tension) from Ed York to clean with. I lost interest in the line as there was no good cleaning chemicals to run under the Cimex at that time. And then came Rick Gelinas and the rest was history.

Rambo,

We tried the LST also. Did you ever use the little ozone machines that Ed York sold? Prior to learning about Rick, our Cimex machines were either being used to occasionally pre-scrub for HWE or were collecting dust.

The chemical development changed a lot of things.

I started using the Cimex in 1994 also, LST and the Ed York ozone box. the buildings we cleaned in Atlata were a pleasure to see every month. We also did alot of bonnet cleaning and used our TM to do ground floors and in some cases 2nd story floors.

Tom Zurzolo of EverClean Corp helped me see cleaning in a different way and to this day i'm indebted to him for his guidance in my knowledge of all things commercial!!

PS Chuck Violand was a big part of Tom's success in the commercial sales and financial aspect of this business.

David, I had three of those Ozone boxes made by Workmaster. Jeff Brown got my last one for $20. That period was like the "dark ages" but like Shorty, I too have seen the light and changed my ways.