I really like the idea of being able to rinse the carpet and leave a protective shield on the fiber, and this is what I think the Encap Punch offers ... right? My question is, though, does it offer any CLEANING ability when used as an extraction rinse, or is it just that ... only a rinse?

I like my extraction rinse to clean well, too. Currently I am using Clean-it. It is a wonderful one-step cleaning product but, of course, I'm not too keen on the residual, since it doesn't encapsulate.

Tell me the truth ... no BS ... does the punch offer any cleaning ability?

I use it with HWE & Bonnet Cleaning as the stand alone cleaning agent. Mix it stronger and use as a pre-spray.

This post may be of help. http://www.network54.com/Forum/228309/message/1162501134/

Richard Brooks
Hit The Spot
Exceeding Client Expectations

I know you are not a big fan of encapsulating versus HWE on cut pile but here is what I just did a few minutes ago...

I had an apartment community call me to look at a unit. I charge .26 per square for HWE and they refuse to use me on a regular basis because I am too expensive.

However they gladly pay me $250-$500 per apartment when I can save a carpet and keep them from replacing it for over $1,000. And I happily take that money for a solid 2-3 hours of work on a carpet- ALWAYS HWE with a Sprint pre-scrub.

Well today their regular cleaner: $29.99 per 1 Bedroom (my price- $101.40) and $39.99 per 2 Bedroom (my price- $156.00) was busy and could not make it over. They needed a unit cleaned tonight and were willing to pay my $101.40 price for HWE.

The carpet really was not in that bad of shape. I presrayed Punch with my Sprint at 8oz per gallon (the lowest dilution). The carpet looked really great.

I went into the office and talked to them about their needs. Like almost anybody else all they want is clean carpets. They could care less about SOA chemicals, NASA, XRF, SOA equipment, HWE vs. Encap, and yes even warranty issues. They simply want it to look good.

I had the manager come over and look at the encap job. She told me it looks better then the $29.99 HWE guy (ABSOLUTELY NO SHOCK TO ME OF COURSE). So now with ALOT less work on my part I walked with $78.00 (loss of $23.40- well worth not lugging out the portable) they were very happy and so was I with the "quick cash".

Now I know right now you are gonna beat on me for not using HWE in an apartment- but my client was satisfied. I explained the differences and the issues and again still satisfied and happily paid me my $78.00.

So does Punch clean- YES- even with no extraction.


Del Scrivner
Owner/Operator
Cowboy's Carpet Care

What is the proper dilution ratio of Encap-Punch? I could not find it anywhere on the product description.

DILUTION RATES:

TRAFFIC LANE PRE-SPRAY:
Per Gallon Dilutions
Light Soil = 8 oz 1:16
Medium Soil = 10 oz 1:12
Heavy Soil = 12 oz 1:10

RINSE DETERGENT:
Dilution Truckmount: 1 quart per 5 gallons of stock solution.
Dilution Portable: 2-4 ounces per 5 gallons.

BONNET/PAD DETERGENT:
Dilution 8 oz per gallon.

Del Scrivner
Owner/Operator
Cowboy's Carpet Care

Del:

You used a Sprint. Is that the new CBM that Rick is selling? If so, then you example may not really be of much help to me. I have noticed with other encap formulas that they aren't worth a darn as presprays prior to HWE, but work wonderfully as stand alone encap. chemicals because of the aggitation of the CBM. Add the aggitation and almost any encap. chemical works.

Oh, and don't worry about me ragging on you too much about using stand alone encap. in that apartment. I figure apartment managers get what they deserve. It's when it's used on a well paying, naive homeowner that I get irritated.

I use it as a HWE Pre-Spray too. In fact I will use up what End Zone, Zone Perfect, Boost All, and Citrisolv I have on hand and probably not buy any more. I have found that Punch has handled all of the jobs that the more complicated (and time consuming) cocktail handles.

In fact it has worked as well as Traffic Slam, but have not needed to use my Flex in a real long time, so I can't compare to the "Nuker" chemical.

It is sooooooooooo much easier to just use one jug (portable guy, so I have to carry jug(s) around to my equipment/water.

Everybody has there preferences of course, but Punch is doing very well for me.

The Sprint is Rick's older CRB machine. It has a tank on board and I love my Sprint machine. Helluva lot more expensive then my carpet rake, but 100000% more impressive. The pet hair I get up- WOW!!!!

It is an additional USP (Unique Selling Position) for me. None, and I mean none of my jobs have ever had anyone "power scrub" the prespray in- it REALLY sets me apart. I am about to raise my HWE prices due to it.

Del Scrivner
Owner/Operator
Cowboy's Carpet Care

LOL ... I use that "power scrub" line when I use my GLS.

Shouldn't you be in bed at this hour?

I have used a lot of products over the years and was very happy with prochem ultra-pac and the Bridgepoint products.We started using the Steamin Demon a few years back and needed something safe, effective and low foaming. We started using the punch with a CRB and would sometimes boost with boost & buff all, the results were outstanding. Usually by the time I was ready to use the SD the customer couldn't say enough about how great the carpet looked and was I already done.I have narrowed my products down considerably. I cleaned those same carpets once or twice since then and wondered why since they were still very clean looking.I have been doing this since 1967 which does not make me an expert only older. I have seen the evolution of all types of equipment, procedures and certifications and if you thoroughly investigate them you will find flaws that need to be addressed by the indivigual and what works for them.There are a miriad of examples of this but that would be counter productive to bring them up. As an old friend of mine reminds me " a person with an experience is never at the mercy of someone with an argument against it". I don't know about you folks but i'm still learning and am open to new thoughts and views, that why I come to this board.

Wayne

I too have become a big fan of Punch. I mainly use it on the nasty commercial by pre-spraying it and allowing 5 to 10 min. dwell time before going over it with Releasit DS in the Cimex. I also use it as a stand alone with HWE.

Rambo, are you an ex-newspaper man? You come up with some great headlines.

Richard Brooks
Hit The Spot
Exceeding Client Expectations

Is that the question? Can you just spray down the punch, let it dwell and extract and have good results? or is it meant to be used in combo with other chems but is a part of your water rinse? I am curious too.

I have pre sprayed the punch, but I agitated it with my challenger then used the SD to extract...excellent results! Is agitation needed though?

Yes it will clean when used as an extraction rinse.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's about time.

Now, answer my other question. Does it need agitation?

Rick's cleaners are the only ones Ihave used for the last 3 years.
It makes it simpler on what to carry.I use punch and HWE on residentals
only and encap on commercial and rentals. I sometimes forget to
turn on my rinse solution for some jobs and I never have had a problem
cleaning. I never rely on my rinse solution for cleaning, becuase
someone is going to have to prove to me that it is the rinse solution doing the cleaning and not the prespray. I do believe that it will
boost the cleaning to a degree but most rinse solutions are a
marketing solution for most chemical makers.
What I like about Ricks it will not leave a residue
that will come back and haunt you or the customer. Punch is strong
enough for me with out going to extremes on chemicals and PH.

Agitation no more or no less than any other product. Judgement call on your part.

I almost forgot the question at hand. I very rarely aggitate except on
area's that are really bad but for the most parts no

Punch is my preferred pre-spray for OP...better than Cobb's. i like Cobb's stuff for Encap, but for OP i prefer Punch.

probably doesn't answer your question much though.

thanx --- Derek.

You do not need agitation with Punch on normal soil load. Just finished a Day Care Center w/SD and Punch. Pre-sprayed Punch through the SD Dial a mixer set at #22, let dwell for 5 minutes, Flush w/SD, came out great. I have never been a fan of "rinse" chems. It is a manafestation of the Devil to put down one chem to clean with and then have to put down another chem to rinse out the chem you used to clean with, or to make it "netural" again. The best rinse in the world is water IMHO.

i agree, to "have" to use 2 is ridiculous.

but if you like spending $ on cleaning solutions, go for it.

thanx --- Derek.

The use of an emulsifier in HWE cleaning has been shown to remove more soil than a plain water rinse. In fact, plain water rinses are mainly a BB generated phenominon. If you talk to a HWE cleaner who has had no exposure to BB discusions you will find that almost all use an emulsifier in their cleaning process. It simply cleans better, rinses better and is more time efficient. With the reduction of natural fibers in the carpet mfg. process, the utility of an acid rinse is not what it used to be either. In times past, cleaners would switch to an acid rinse for use on wools and wool oriental rugs, but with the advent of acid side detergents and neutral cleaning agents, the use of acid rinses as dramatically declined over the past few years. Recent studies have also shown that the surfactants within most acid rinses cause more harm than good. The residue left is actually more harmful than a well formulated detergent.

Chemical manufacturers such Prochem have long recommended the use of a carpet detergent (emulsifier) as the most effective rinsing agents for use in HWE. The use of detergents rinses has long since evolved beyond the old days when they were used necessary to boost the effectiveness of poorly made presprays. These days they are designed more for their wetting/rinsing abilities than they are for actual cleaning.

Although, there are a few who do a very good job at both.

Never let yourself believe that the VLM sector of our industry is the only one that is capable of producing harmless residual agents.

We do agree on something....

For the die hard acid rinsers who want an acid rinse and the benefit if an emulsifier there is End Zone and Action Extraction which both products preform well.