Anybody ever do this?

Possibly the first time on a commercial account who has signed on for regular maintenance.

HWE with just water then Cimex?

A couple of things:

1. Why just water? Why not use Punch and get some actual cleaning done at the same time.

2. I have never Cimexed first then HWE'd, some guys here have. However I am a huge fan of pre-spraying Punch with my Sprint vs. a pump up sprayer and a carpet rake/brush, then doing HWE- mostly residential. I use Punch in both the Sprint and the HWE. You could use the Cimex just as well to prespray/agitate with Punch too.

3. What is your goal by using both systems? Personally I would think if you were going go Cimex second I'd use bonnets and get some additional soil removal and drying out of the deal.

Del Scrivner
Owner/Operator
Cowboy's Carpet Care

the big problem with CGD is wicking. to apply just water assisting that problem. use Punch.

thanx --- Derek.

Agree that using just water makes no sense, a little Punch would break the soil bond and then you would be extracting some soil.

Why HWE First?

Simply just HWE with plain water will do very little, although temperature will make a difference.

You need a wetting agent to break the surface tension that will help break down the soil bonding to the carpet.

Applying the wetting agent and agitation would achieve this.

If you are going to apply a detergent, in all probability it will have to be rinsed to remove soil attracting residues.

If you are going to this extent, why not use a compatible product such as Punch ??

Then you would go ahead and Cimex clean the carpet.

Cheers,

Shorty.



I've seen the light, and changed my ways.

I'm guessing the HWE is to achieve a flushing/rinsing of the carpet with a low cost "solvent" water? Then following with the Cimex. Is this immediately after HWE or after the carpet has dried to address possible wicking with the Cimex & Releasit?
Again, why not use Punch as a pre-treat applied by whichever means/eqmt. then extract and bonnet afterwards? With the use of Punch & dryers might not have to use Cimex afterwards to address wickback?
What kind of carpet was this commercial acct.? Level loop or cut pile, etc. I think that info would help determine the "therapy" used. Also, when is this being done? Are you going after the "shock and awe" value or fitting it into a schedule of other things to do?
Is the pace of life slower in Canada?

Like the other kool aid drinkers above, I don't see the point of just using water in your HWE step, but I do see the benefit of combining methods. My worst commercial account has been salvaged by combining HWE and post encapsulation cleaning. I do it there every month.

agreed multi-method CC'ing is, while not always practical, King.

multi-method VLM'er at this point --- Derek.

Derek,
you mentioned in your post 3 months ago that you clean a resturant every two months. You use bonnets. how many sets do you go through per 1000 sq.f.? DO they cause you to use more than the usual amout of SOL?

Heres a question: Should i scrub pre/punch in with cimex or rotary before i clean with cimex/DS?

Crucial question: Did you pre-vac being that there was grease in the fibers, if so how did the grease affect your vacuum?



Thanks
Your Servant Alex

i cimexed a pretty dirty but not trashed cgd last night. with the cimex and soft shampoo brushes and larry cobbs juice spiked with a little chemspecs energizer and it went/looked very good afterwards.and since i had help i asked him to post extract on the traffic lanes only to no available difference. except to know that you went the extra step.

I remember a while back Rick did a dual method with his steamin demon and cimex.While I have yet to do this I am going to have to do this in a commercial account of mine this weekend.I tried to padcap it and was less than satisfied.Upon further inspection I rwealized it is full of soil.So when I extract first am I pulling the soil up to the top and then e-capping it off?

It depends on if you are padding it after it has had time to dry, or if you are post padding it while still damp.

After you HWE, the remaining soil is not "at the top", but is pretty much evenly distributed on the fiber. It is not until the carpet has dried, and wicked, that the soil is found at the top of the fiber.

On still damp carpets, padding, or bonneting, after HWE simply absorbs a portion of the remaining moisture, and thus a percentage of the soils.

I usually wait until it dries (only about an hour and a half) and scrub-n-run.

Thanks Admiral Ibelieve Rick let it dry a full day to allow wicking to occur. Me thinks I will allow a couple of hours. This is the first commercial account I have had to do this on and am waiting to see the results.

There will be a difference in the process if the carpet is Nylon or Olefin. If it is Olefin, I can flush it out with the Steamin Demon (Olefin holds less than 1/10 of it weight in moisture) allowing for a flush removal of the soil. Steamon Demon does the flush better than a standard "truckmount". On the other hand, if it is Nylon, it will hold onto 20 to 21% of its weight in moisture and soil requiring a post padding. I no longer post pad Olefin since using the Steamin Demon.

Where did you get that info. I've always thought that:
Olefin retains up to 0.1% water
Polyester retains up to 0.4% water
Nylon retains up to 4.5% water

Tony, I give you the percentages again; Olefin will only hold 1/10th of 1 percent of it's WEIGHT in moisture, and Nylon can hold up to 21% of it's WEIGHT in moisture, Wool even more, I believe up to 30%. The first time I heard this was on a J&J mill visit and Jim Jolly, the CEO brought it up. I could be wrong. We still use the old Hoover report about dry soil. 85% dry soil that can be removed with a good vacuum cleaner. We can only remove 95% off all the soil in a dirty carpet. After we vacuum and bring in our $48000 "truckmount" to remove the 10% of sticky/oily soil, it seems to me like getting a hammer to kill a fly on the baby's head. I have seen the "soil" and have changed my ways of removing it.

took a break from the 'net for the weekend.

for that restaurant (which is not a grease pit), i go thru 9-15 sets (Cimex uses 3 bonnets per set) per visit. i use less sol with the bonnets than anything else (pads or brushes).

no i wouldn't pre-scrub in Punch bud, but if it were greasy i would mix Punch right into the sol tank with the EncapClean.

since it wasn't greasy, i did pre-vac. but even if it were a grease pit, i'd still pre-vac...it's essential.

hope this helps Bro --- Derek.

Hey Derek thanks.

Job went good! There was two vac's there already, i used them. took me 7 hours. I had one helper, very thorough young man. Just need to balance him out a little. I felt someone looking at me. I turned and there was an older chinese man sitting in the corner watching me. This was the second night i came to finish the last small section.

For some reason i think he was the owner. (Impressed Owner) I hope so anyway.

Anyway i used one set of grey pads the whole time.Not so greasy after all!!
I will be sending them a thank you letter next week.



Thanks
Your Servant Alex

Ray, are you sure it wasn't 2.1% - I've read figures of anywhere from 2,1-4.5%
There is no way that Nylon is 2/3 as absorbant as Wool.

Here is a web-site to check this on:

http://web.utk.edu/~mse/pages/Textiles/Nylon%20fibers.htm

Scroll down to Item 9

9. Properties of Nylon 66

-Specific gravity of 1.14

-4 - 4.5% of moisture regain