Need some advice

[MikeHabib]

When I clean with Encap I have run into problems with very soiled areas. I just cannot get them clean using just an encapsulation method. I always vacuum first, then pre-spray and use either my Oreck Orbitor or a Dirt Napper Brush and then clean with a rotary 175/300 swing machine, and then follow up with a post vacuum. I did a place the other day and in front of the kitchen and sofa's there is still that dark shadow. I am going back with my Rotovac to see what it can do. I have used almost every suppliers chemicals however, this is a problem that I have had for sometime now. Any advice ?

[JuddBowers]

That's a couple of very common traffic pattern areas. They will always have a shadow because of less fiber reflecting light.

On problem areas, if DS2 and Punch can't get it, put a fan on it, let it dry, vacuum, and hit with Hydrox. I use my Orbot, weight set, and superzorb bonnets with success on residential problem areas.

[Derek]

Mike, you didn't mention any dwell time. also what cleaning sol did you use?

when you prescrub with your Oreck perhaps that is drying the cleaning sol out??

other than those questions, perhaps a 175 just isn't aggressive enough compared to an OP...i doubt they are.

reminds me of when i first started encap'ing on CGD...i used a Host with Encap Clean. results were abysmal. i almost gave up on encap right then and there.

fortunately i invested in proper equipment (Cimex with Encap Clean again) and the difference was night and day.

so perhaps a 175 just doesn't cut it on those tougher areas, idk i have never used one on carpet. but i do know how aggressive an OP can be and i find it hard to believe a 175 can be THAT aggressive.

[MikeB]

OP can get very aggressive with cotton pads and no glider. This is what i use on really nasty stuff. That and I have been using a crb in some cases now. You just have to be careful to not go overboard and damage the fibers with an OP, especially on a cut pile plush carpet. Dwell time is important too of course. I haven't tried hydrox yet. DS2 releasit and Punch are all I've been using as far as encap. so far.
I have had those issues before in front of chairs and in "turn spots" in tight hallway entrances where the light just doesn't reflect as well any more. I think there are cases were no level of cleaning is going to correct that. It's frustrating to leave a place feeling like you failed though. Maybe someone else here can be of more help.

[SLOTOOLS]

I started using 6oz ds2 and 3 oz punch per gallon on the heaviest areas- prespray then OP.
Microfiber pad followed by absorbing cotton pad- (glads by ccs) The carpet will fool you until carpet dries and post vacuum. Very good results. Dwell 5-10 mins, although I cannot confirm dwell is helpful as I use 2 different pads for cleaning.

[Derek]

dwell is KEY. i allow 14 minutes...the longer the better but you can't let the prespray dry either or else it is useless.

[TheCleaningDude]

Lots of good advice!

I think a 175 can work if you're using quality pads and chems, though an OP is probably a lot quicker.

Derek mentioned dwell time. Dwell is crucial.

What pads are you using under your rotary? Are you using enough juice?

If possible, get some of the microfiber pads that Rick is selling now. Those are great for pre-scrubbing and some initial extraction. Follow with a wet cotton/terry bad.

Take some pics next time.

[leofry@1966]

someone once told me you can;t polish a terd

[MikeHabib]

I gave it 10 minutes of dwell time, The rotary I use is a 175/300 and I used Micro fiber pads, followed by cotton pads, I then used my dirt napper brush and then again tried the Oreck. I used a citrus pre-pray, then I used Hydrox. I'll see what the Rotovac can do on it. Sometimes I find that you just have to flush it out.

[TheCleaningDude]

Citrus pre-spray? Is it a product generally used for HWE?

I gave it 10 minutes of dwell time, The rotary I use is a 175/300 and I used Micro fiber pads, followed by cotton pads, I then used my dirt napper brush and then again tried the Oreck. I used a citrus pre-pray, then I used Hydrox. I'll see what the Rotovac can do on it. Sometimes I find that you just have to flush it out.

[encapman]

Citrus pre-spray? Is it a product generally used for HWE?

I was wondering the same thing. Citrus solvents can be a bear to get out of the carpet. D'limonene is not the superhero that our industry once thought it was. And d'limonene is not going to play well with an encap polymer.

[Derek]

can Hydrox be boosted with Punch?

if so i'd give that a shot and nix the citrus stuff. and let it dwell 13-14 minutes, that has been better for me than 10 minute dwell time personally.

[JuddBowers]

can Hydrox be boosted with Punch?

if so i'd give that a shot and nix the citrus stuff. and let it dwell 13-14 minutes, that has been better for me than 10 minute dwell time personally.

I think the pH is different on those two. Punch with DS works well. I've heard of guys spiking hydrox with some peroxide from the local beauty supply store though.

[Derek]

i dont think (?) that the pH matters as much as the encap polymers being symbiotic.

[encapman]

i dont think (?) that the pH matters as much as the encap polymers being symbiotic.

What Derek said is accurate.

Encap-HydrOx is acidic, and requires a different polymer than all of our other detergents. The CrystalonHP polymer in Encap-HydrOx is stable in the hydrogen peroxide formula. And so technically speaking, it's not a good idea to cross over with any other products. However if someone still wanted to make a cross over, knowing that there may be a compromise in the crystallization, I'd feel more comfortable making that exception with Encap-Punch because at least it's a polymerized product. Yet the definitive answer is that Encap-HydrOx really works best left to it's own camp, and not mixed with other products.